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Testing of hand wound motors on a dynamometer
Nov 07, 2006
Hand wound Motors
Orion Chrome Modified 9x3
These tests were made on a
CS
Dyno and these motors have at least one commutator rectification and a new set
of brushes.
|
Orion Chrome Touring 11x3 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
70.7 % |
177 W |
36.331 |
39.9 A |
45.57 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
63.1 % |
209 W |
25.974 |
60.9 A |
75.32 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
132 W |
51.010 |
13.5 A |
|
Brushes :
Power Performance 10-30 with Trinity 13oz. springs.
The springs were
really in bad shape and the comm was rectified before the run. It
"just" wnet up 10.000 rpm!! |
On the first pull this motor performed really bad!
Something was wrong
(look at the graph). The curves with the annotations are from the first
test. Panic!!!
- A glitch that causes torque to have a sudden
drop
- The power is suffering a lot with the problem
- Look at this efficiency curve!! Can we call it
that? curve?
- The current does not flow. Why?
A close inspection revealed
weakened springs due to excessive heat. But even then it was not Ok and I
just cut the comm with a diamond tip. It went up 10.000 rpm. Incredible difference
that illustrates what a good maintenance plan can do to a motor,
performance wise.
Orion Chrome Touring 11x3 These tests were made on a
CS
Dyno and these motors have at least one commutator rectification and a new set
of brushes.
|
Orion Chrome Touring 11x3 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
74.9 % |
163 W |
30285 |
34.0 A |
50.27 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
60.3 % |
187 W |
19933 |
58.2 A |
88.06 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
119 W |
45123 |
11.2 A |
|
| Brushes :
Power Performance 10-30 with Orion 150º springs. This motor is almost
near the end...no more copper to cut. |
Integy 7.5
10x3
I've made a couple of tests on the dyno and I
reached some conclusions (a detailed comparison can be seen
here):
- This motor likes 30º advance. With 25% the
efficiency drops below 60% at max power. With 30º stays happily in
the 60% range
- It loves comm drops (with the Orion 10-30
Power Brushes)
- The max efficiency point is much closer to
the max power point than with the other 10x3 that I have. In one of
the tests the difference was just 4W!!
- Keep an eye on those removable magnets they
have the bad habit of moving from their place. Glue them! The same
goes for the D4's.
- You definitely need a smaller pinion with
this one! The rpm is higher than all the other 10x3 that I have.
Almost 6.000 rpm more than the Peak Aurora.
|
Integy 7.5 10x3 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
73.9 % |
181 W |
34.586 |
39.1 A |
50.41 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
65.5 % |
201 W |
26.613 |
54.8 A |
72.67 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
127 W |
49.667 |
16.3 A |
|
| Brushes : Orion Power Performance
10-30, Orion 150º springs, comm in bad shape and 30º timming |
Fantom Modified 10x3
These tests were made on a
CS
Dyno and these motors have at least one commutator rectification and a new set
of brushes.
|
Fantom 10x3 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
77.4% |
179 W |
32992 |
36.4 A |
49.64 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
64.7 % |
208 W |
22375 |
61.0 A |
84.97 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
132 W |
47267 |
12.3 A |
|
| Brushes :
Orion Power Performance 10-30 with original springs (hard). Tests after
9-10 runs and one comm rectification. |
Corally
Pro Series 9x2
These tests were made on a
CS
Dyno and these motors have at least one commutator rectification and a new set
of brushes.
|
Corally 9x2 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
73.3 % |
177 W |
36.858 |
38.5 A |
46.48 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
62.8 % |
202 W |
26.060 |
60.1 A |
75.17 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
128 W |
52.696 |
13.8 A |
|
| Brushes :
Corally included with the motor. 1 comm rectification. |
Corally Pro Series 10x2
These tests were made on a
CS
Dyno and these motors have at least one commutator rectification and a new set
of brushes.
|
Corally 10x2 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
76.1 % |
169 W |
35307 |
34.0 A |
43.73 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
68.2 % |
209 W |
25319 |
54.6 A |
75.27 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
132 W |
48576 |
14.6 A |
|
| Brushes :
Corally 10-20 (Hard) with Corally gold springs. 12 runs and 1 comm rectification. |
Reedy Fury MW 9x3
These tests were made on a
CS
Dyno and these motors have at least one commutator rectification and a new set
of brushes.
|
Reedy Fury MW 9x3 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
77.9 % |
166 W |
36.727 |
32.2 A |
42.37 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
66.9 % |
214 W |
23.905 |
58.6 A |
83.98 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
136 W |
48.831 |
11.7 A |
|
| Brushes :
Original. 5 runs and 1 comm rectification. |
Trinity D4 9x2
These tests were made on a
CS
Dyno and these motors have at least one commutator rectification and a new set
of brushes.
|
Trinity D4 9x2 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
73.6 % |
154 W |
33.187 |
31.9 A |
43.74 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
63.2 % |
196 W |
23.474 |
55.3 A |
78.70 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
124 W |
44.510 |
8.3 A |
|
| Brushes :
Orion Power Performance 10-30 original springs 1st run after comm
rectification |
Oh well, not brilliant. the Corally 10x2 (above) beats
this baby big time. What did I say? The motor was a bullet, and after that comm
truing never was the same again.
Reedy Ti 10x2
These tests were made on a
CS
Dyno.
|
Reedy Ti 10x2 |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
74.8 % |
143 W |
32.340 |
26.6 A |
38.58 Nmm |
| 77.8 % |
177 W |
28.759 |
35.6 A |
56.59 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
66.5 % |
186 W |
21.248 |
46.9 A |
76.47 Nmm |
| 67.1 % |
205 W |
20.944 |
55.4 A |
89.79 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
|
118 W |
42.770 |
10.5 A |
|
|
|
130 W |
42.647 |
9.5 A |
|
Brushes :
Original brushes. Out of the box.
2nd set of results after 1 commutator rectification.
Look at the improvement!!
|
Peak Aurora 10x3
1/1/2001 - The dyno tests are not brilliant. The motor
had lots of slop and needed one more shim in the arm. The system that holds the
brushes in order to avoid movement (small metal spring on the bottom of the
brush) didn't allow the brushes to move back and forth.
The first dyno test was terrible. The power and efficiency curve had a very
strange drop at around 25.000 rpm. Something was very wrong. The second pull was
better and the drop moved forward to the 38.000 rpm range. Probably due to the
fact that the brushes were not touching the comm as they should. After some
tampering I was able to have a "normal" power curve, but the motor
revs less than the Fantom 10x3 (direct comparison). You have a comparison
between all my 10x3 (my God, I found out that I have 4 10x3!!!). The stock timming on the Peak is 25º and they use hard
serrated brushes and the springs seem to be Orion 150º.
|
|
|
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
Fantom 10x3 |
77.4% |
179 W |
32.992 |
36.4 A |
49.64 Nmm |
| Peak Aurora 10x3 |
75.0 % |
143 W |
34.971 |
28.0 A |
37.61 Nmm |
| "Corallynity"
10x3 |
68.40% |
167 W |
31.880 |
37.0 A |
47.00 Nmm |
| Integy 7.5 10x3 |
73.9 % |
181 W |
34.586 |
39.1 A |
50.41 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
Fantom 10x3 |
64.7 % |
208 W |
22.375 |
61.0 A |
84.97 Nmm |
| Peak Aurora 10x3 |
64.5 % |
207 W |
23.155 |
58.0 A |
82.13 Nmm |
| "Corallynity" 10x3 |
62.1% |
196 W |
24.400 |
55.0 A |
73.00 Nmm |
| Integy 7.5 10x3 |
65.5 % |
201 W |
26.613 |
54.8 A |
72.67 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
Fantom 10x3 |
|
132 W |
47.267 |
12.3 A |
|
| Peak Aurora 10x3 |
|
131 W |
43.776 |
7.2 A |
|
| "Corallynity" 10x3 |
|
na |
46.680 |
na |
|
| Integy 7.5
10x3 |
|
127 W |
49.667 |
16.3 A |
|
All the pulls of the Fantom were above 199W but this 207W
pull with the Aurora was the only one. I have values from 191W to this only 207W
result.
Lots of torque at the point of max Power (9.11% more) but
2000 rpm less and 3.6 Amps more of current draw. At the point of max efficiency
the motor is 18.18% less powerful and 16.27% less torque. A good motor guy may
look at these numbers under a different light, probably compensate them with
gearing, but to me looks like the Aurora is not as strong as the Fantom.
The surprise was reserved for the Integy 10x3. When I put
the motor on the dyno I was expecting a really bad result. The comm needed a
rectification, and the past experiences were not that good. Surprise, surprise!
This baby delivers 49.667 rpm and the point of max efficiency is much closer to
the point of max power than the other motors. If you look to the table above
you'll see that's almost at the same level as the Fantom 10x3, but with almost
2.000 rpm more. I guess I
didn't choose the gearing as I should. A trip to the lathe, hood alignment (it
was really out of alignment, and getting fed up with the neat copper hoods and
removable magnets...why would I want to remove them for? To put a new pair?) and the next test will be done today. I'll give it
another try.
Track testing will tell the rest. However the bench
testing points to a motor that is inferior to the Fantom and the Reedy (the
Fantom is based on the same design as Reedy).
New motors will soon follow: Reedy Rage 9x3 Millenium
Wind and Corally Pro Series 9x2. If you are thinking something like
"This guy must be mad!!!" you are close to the truth
 .
I test ALL my motors and some of my friend's motors too. Hope you profit from
this.
You've seen the results above from the testing with my
CS Dyno. The table on the Motor page reflected my "feeling" without any
measuring equipment. It's seems pretty much on target, doesn't it? Let's now compare apples with apples.
|
|
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
Fantom 10x3 |
77.4% |
179 W |
32992 |
36.4 A |
49.64 Nmm |
| Orion Touring 11x3 |
74.9 % |
163 W |
30285 |
34.0 A |
50.27 Nmm |
| Corally 10x2 |
76.1 % |
169 W |
35307 |
34.0 A |
43.73 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
Fantom 10x3 |
64.7 % |
208 W |
22375 |
61.0 A |
84.97 Nmm |
| Orion Touring 11x3 |
60.3 % |
187 W |
19933 |
58.2 A |
88.06 Nmm |
| Corally 10x2 |
68.2 % |
209 W |
25319 |
54.6 A |
75.27 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
Fantom 10x3 |
|
132 W |
47267 |
12.3 A |
|
| Orion Touring 11x3 |
|
119 W |
45123 |
11.2 A |
|
| Corally 10x2 |
|
132 W |
48576 |
14.6 A |
|
The following results are from the test with the hybrid
motor made from a D4 can and a 10x3 Corally handwound arm. I've used several
combinations of brushes and springs after shimming the motor correctly, with
BB lubrication before each run and allowing the brushes to sit correctly.
|
"Corallynity" 10x3 |
Efficiency (%) |
Power (W) |
RPM |
Current draw (A) |
Torque (Nmm) |
| at Max Efficiency |
Orion 10-30, Orion 150º springs
run 1 |
70.90% |
147 |
32786 |
32 |
42 |
| Orion 10-30, Orion 150º springs
run 2 |
66.00% |
166 |
30753 |
39 |
48 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
run 1 |
70.40% |
155 |
33351 |
33 |
41 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
run 2 |
71.30%
1 |
142 |
33259 |
31
1 |
39 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
comm drops |
67.30% |
163 |
30895 |
37 |
46 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
comm drops (2) |
68.20% |
177 2 |
30211 |
41 |
53 2 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
clean comm |
68.40% |
167 |
31880 |
37 |
47 |
| at Max Power |
Orion 10-30, Orion 150º Springs run 1 |
60.30% |
179 |
23455 |
54 |
71 |
| Orion 10-30, Orion 150º Springs
run 2 |
58.60% |
186 |
23483 |
55 |
70 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
run 1 |
62.40% |
195 |
23913 |
55 |
71 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
run 2 |
60.30% |
190 |
21580 |
61 |
82 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs comm drops |
62.80% 3 |
201 3 |
23885 |
56 |
73 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs comm drops (2) |
59.20% |
198 |
22123 |
62 |
82 |
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs clean comm |
62.10% |
196 |
24400 |
55 |
73 |
| at Max RPM |
Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs run 2 |
|
|
46680 |
|
|
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
comm drops |
|
|
46457 |
|
|
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
comm drops (2) |
|
|
47753 |
|
|
| Corally 10-20, Orion 150º springs
clean comm |
|
|
46436 |
|
|
| Orion 10-30, Orion 150º Springs |
|
|
47075 |
|
|
1 The brushes seated perfectly and
efficiency went up and Amp load down.
2 More power? More torque? Comm drops....
3 I would never suspect that comm drops had such an impact
on power and efficiency
Conclusions - If I want torque on this motor (tight
track) I will use Corally 10-20 brushes with Orion Springs 150º and if I want
power and rpm, I'll just use comm drops. The Orion 10-30 with the same springs
or even Trinity silver spring (13oz.) seem to be more or less the same with
this motor. Comm drops help the motor rev a little more, deliver more power at
the expense of a higher amp draw. However, these drops don't last an entire 5
minute race. The effect seems to disappear on the 3rd dyno run.
I was so fed up with the EPIC can (D4) after breaking
another copper tab, that I decided to test the same Corally 10x3 arm inside a
TOP can (Orbital Pro 2 BB). The brushes were aligned, and the brushes aren't
even the same (these ones come with the original motor) they are hard copper
with eyelet. The springs are Orion 150º. Look at the efficiency, compared with
the D4 can...
|
Corally armature 10x3 handwound |
Efficiency |
Power |
RPM |
Current draw |
Torque |
| at Max Efficiency |
Epic (D4) can |
65.4 % |
149 W |
33.924 |
34.6 A |
40.44 Nmm |
| Top (orbital
pro2) can run 1 |
74.1 % |
165 W |
33.297 |
35.0 A |
48.48 Nmm |
| Top (orbital
pro2) can run 2 |
75.7 % |
167 W |
33.060 |
34.8 A |
47.41 Nmm |
| Top (orbital
pro2) can run 3 |
74.9 % |
153 W |
34.921 |
31.2 A |
40.81 Nmm |
| Top (orbital
pro2) can run 4 |
75.5 % |
155 W |
34.599 |
31.1 A |
41.36 Nmm |
| at Max Power |
Epic (D4) can |
60.0 % |
188 W |
24.568 |
54.7 A |
70.45 Nmm |
| Top (orbital pro2) can run 1 |
64.4 % |
201 W |
22.971 |
58.7 A |
82.05 Nmm |
| Top (orbital pro2) can run 2 |
63.8 % |
196 W |
22.680 |
57.4 A |
81.04 Nmm |
| Top (orbital pro2) can run 3 |
67.3 % |
196 W |
25.312 |
51.5 A |
72.07 Nmm |
| Top (orbital pro2) can run 4 |
62.5 % |
196 W |
22.294 |
57.7 A |
81.13 Nmm |
| at Max RPM |
Epic (D4) can |
|
119 W |
46.968 |
13.9 A |
|
| Top (orbital
pro2) can run 1 |
|
127 W |
47.233 |
10.7 A |
|
| Top (orbital
pro2) can run 2 |
|
124 W |
47.159 |
10.3 A |
|
| Top (orbital
pro2) can run 3 |
|
124 W |
47.168 |
10.5 A |
|
| Top (orbital
pro2) can run 4 |
|
124 W |
46.994 |
10.5 A |
|
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